Need list of antioxidants
Question:
>> My recommedation would be to cut back on, not necessarilly cut out, the > big antioxidant contributors, >I do not see any consistant scientific research which does back up
You are correct. However, Robert seemed to be concerned about eliminating anti-oxidants and that’s the only way I can see to do it. Of course, I had to limit my research to what I had energy for, so I’m *sure* it was incomplete. >this statement. In contrary, most of the things on your list, like >broccoli, have cancer fighting properties, eg:
Yup, well known. One of my favorite vegetables, too. However, if your goal is to eliminate antioxidants, which one *animal* study recently showed to be *very* beneficial, then you have to loose the benefits that go with those foods. This would definitely not be recommended for long term chemo, but until more research is done, doing it for a week or two might be considered a complementary treatment. Perhaps it would be good to check with a dietician first. Sorry I don’t have a reference for the study, I came accross it before Robert posted. I thought it was interesting to read once. It looks to me that it is not yet at the point of being worth considering since, IIRC, the animals diets were modified from birth. >So I would advice the opposite: Decrease red meat, but increase all >kinds of vegetables, fruits and fish.
Yup, I’d agree. It just doesn’t answer the question. Chicken is a favorite here, salmon steak once in a while, pasta too. I’m reluctant to get too much of the contaminants that are so often found in seafood, I always have been. >Yes, selenium has a weak base as an anti cancer agent, but it has shown >to decrease the _risk_ of several cancers by about 50% in a big study.
Risks of individual cancers already tend to be pretty small numbers. I would like to see something that could tackle the "one in three." Actually, I’ve been thinking about this for years. Time for a new thread. >BTW: Potatoes are high in vit. C.
NO! NO! Don’t say that! Uhm, the vitamin C goes away when you, er, ah, mash them, right? Yeah, that’s the story, and I’m sticking to it! <grin> <I wish!> I didn’t mention squash. I didn’t find then at the Mayo, but since they taste good <grin> and have color I’m pretty sure they must be high in *some* form of antioxidant. — "Life is a non-renewable resource, use it well." Send no SPAM. "Hon, am I confused? Oh, sorry miss." http://pages.infinit.net/curlypp/
Response:
>During chemotherapy it is recommended to avoid antioxidants and then resume >afterwards. Can anyone tell me where antioxidants can be found- in what
Humph! All these "supplement experts" spamming us and not one willing to give a serious answer to a serious question. <sigh> OK, I’ll try, but all I did for my radiation is cut out orange juice. I found OJ great for dry mouth and odd tastes in my mouth and I like it, so I knew if I didn’t cut it out I’d drink a lot of it. It turns out I need not have bothered. All the things I replaced it with are from foods on the list below! <sigh> I’ve been drinking more *water* during the last week, it looks that’s the only thing that is not an antioxidant. References: go to http://www.mayohealth.org/mayo/common/htm/search.htm and search for the keyword "antioxidants". I only made it half way through the list of 42 articles that returned, I looked at 10 of the 21(?) articles in that half. I built the two lists below from those articles. Conclusion: Holy kalrobi, Batman! Everything is an antioxidant! There are so many foods that are antioxidants that trying to root them all out of your diet would leave you with a very unhealthy, boring diet. For cancer prevention, many of the pages recommended not worrying about antioxidants. Just eating a ballanced diet would almost guarantee you a number of sources of antioxidants. For cancer treatment, removing all antioxidants would probably leave you on a very *un*healthy diet. So again, it is probably more important to have a healthy diet than to eliminate all sources of antioxidants. My recommedation would be to cut back on, not necessarilly cut out, the big antioxidant contributors, such as fruits and vegetables high in vitamin C (citrus, tomato, grapes, brocolli) and increase (don’t try to subsist on only these) the foods that are conspicuous by their absense from the list: meat, squash, starchy foods such as potatoe, rice and corn. Increase your intake of undiluted water. THE LISTS Suplements: vitamin A beta-carotene vitamin C selenium vitamin E the carotenoids group Foods: green tea red wine grapes tomatoes watermelon pink grapefruit apples onions garlic leeks chives broccoli cabbage kale caulifower soybeans citrus fruits carrots whole grains nuts grapes red wine beans legumes cherries citrus peel arugula bok choy broccoli sprouts swiss chard collards kale kohlrabi mustard greens radishes rutabaga turnips turnip greens watercress — "Life is a non-renewable resource, use it well." Send no SPAM. "Hon, am I confused? Oh, sorry miss." http://pages.infinit.net/curlypp/
Response:
>Your immune system is under attack undergoing chemo! >Check with MD Dr. Ray Strand, http://wwwraystrand.com >Yikes! Avoiding antioxidants?
Yes, sometimes. Did you think there was always one identical, simple answer to everything in the human body? Not! It is a very complicated body, you know. On this doctor’s (?) web page I found a few red flags, but I did eventually find a reference to chemo, radiation and "oxidative stress," (a term I can not find elsewhere). Medications and Radiation Medication is synthetic and a foreign chemical to the body. The body must eliminate it and in the process it produces excessive free radicals. Some of the greatest offenders are the chemotherapeutic agents. Several studies show much of toxic effects to the body are related to oxidative stress. Radiation treatment causes tremendous increase in free-radical production and ultimately leads to oxidative stress no matter what part of the body is exposed to the radiation. Obviously, plain X-rays and CT scans produce increased amounts of free radicals but not to the same extent as radiation therapy. I’m surprised to see a doctor make such a generalization as "Medication is synthetic [snip] in the process it produces excessive free radicals." Doctors know that any substance deliberately introduced to the body for the purpose of healing is "medicine." This paragraph implies that fresh squeezed orange juice is synthetic if taken for it’s anti-oxidant effect and that taking orange juice or vitamin E (anti-oxidants!) *create* a free radical problem. *Not all medicines have the same side effects*! When he says "Several studies show much of toxic effects to the body are related to oxidative stress" which studies are these? He does not give any references, so they might as well be studies titled "what dr strand wants to say in his book." Can you show otherwise? Then he says "Radiation treatment causes tremendous increase in free-radical production" but he fails to say that this is a *necessary* part of the treatment. Radiation treatment *uses* free radicals to kill the tumor cells, while minimizing that form of damage to healthy cells. Are you upset that the tumor is damaged by free radicals? By providing part of the data, but leaving out some critical information, "Dr." Strand is, IMO, lying. He does not actually *say* you should take antioxidants during radiation treatment, but IMO he avoids explaining anything that might reduce his sales. ISTM that he thinks it is OK to give to only part of the data, then let the reader jump to the wrong conclusion. This is not OK, it is lying by omission. This is the reason the courts ask you to "tell the whole truth," and the reason peer-reviewed journals insist on the same kind of disclosure. >Your immune system is under attack >undergoing chemo! Check with MD Dr. Ray Strand, http://wwwraystrand.com
Would it not be better to check with the doctors who are familiar with your case and have read your chart? Ray Strand does not know anything about *your* case that they do not. They, on the other hand, know all about what medicines you are taking, what physical condition you are in, and how depleted (or not) your immune system is. Do you think this stuff about the immune system is some new idea that only alternative practitioners know about? If you can get some help outside the established medical communitty and your doctor agrees that it will not interfere with your current treatment, go for it. But *do not* take pills or diets or other alternative treatments during your standard treatment unless your oncologist approves it! >Your doctor may as well told you not have a healthy diet.
You say this like you know. Are you a trained medical professional? What hospital can we call to verify your credentials? — "Life is a non-renewable resource, use it well." Send no SPAM. "Hon, am I confused? Oh, sorry miss." http://pages.infinit.net/curlypp/
Response:
Yikes! Avoiding antioxidants? Your immune system is under attack undergoing chemo! Check with MD Dr. Ray Strand, http://wwwraystrand.com Your doctor may as well told you not have a healthy diet. Good Luck! RES – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->During chemotherapy it is recommended to avoid antioxidants and then resume >afterwards. > Only your onc can answer this and your onc may not be able to discuss > alternative meds. > The answer depends in part on what chemo, combination of chemo, > concurrent radiation and so on you are taking. It may be that the > antioxidants would interfere with the treatment, or it may be that > they would help. Only your oncologist knows for sure. > — > "Life is a non-renewable resource, use it well." Send no SPAM. > "Hon, am I confused? Oh, sorry miss." http://pages.infinit.net/curlypp/
Response:
> During chemotherapy it is recommended to avoid antioxidants and then resume > afterwards. Can anyone tell me where antioxidants can be found- in what > foods, vitamins, herbs, etc.? Please be as specific as possible. > Thanks very much in advance! > -Robert >Try ACES
should help all your needs for V… It is of immense importance to learn to laugh at ourselves. –Katherine Mansfield//////Question one at a time or a combo? Before you buy.
Response:
>During chemotherapy it is recommended to avoid antioxidants and then resume >afterwards.
Only your onc can answer this and your onc may not be able to discuss alternative meds. The answer depends in part on what chemo, combination of chemo, concurrent radiation and so on you are taking. It may be that the antioxidants would interfere with the treatment, or it may be that they would help. Only your oncologist knows for sure. — "Life is a non-renewable resource, use it well." Send no SPAM. "Hon, am I confused? Oh, sorry miss." http://pages.infinit.net/curlypp/
Response:
During chemotherapy it is recommended to avoid antioxidants and then resume afterwards. Can anyone tell me where antioxidants can be found- in what foods, vitamins, herbs, etc.? Please be as specific as possible. Thanks very much in advance! -Robert – – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –
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